Nintendo And Pokémon File Lawsuit Against Palworld Developer Pocketpair

I want the Pokémon Company to lose so badly.
You can't patent or copyright a concept, you can't patent or own an idea. The monster-collecting RPG genre is just that — a genre.
Unless The Pokémon Company magically owns some patents to the concept of "sandbox-survival genre games" that I don't know about 😒
Palword skirts the line between parody, or even homage, sure. But it in no way was advertised or sold as a Pokémon product. This should not hold up in an infringement case.
There should not be a world where entire corporations have patented ownership of specific game genres.

I see their strategy, wait a year, for Palworld to make money, then sue them for all of it. Bold move.

Filing a lawsuit randomly 9 months after the game came out is such a Nintendo thing to do

This is a very big shame. Palworld is a fantastic game that has only been evolving more and more since its release. I haven't been sucked into a game much like I did with this one since, and definitely not any Pokémon game, that's for sure.

I'm really hoping they win this, Palworld is already such a good game but I've been enjoying the updates and was really hoping to see a "1.0" release.

@LadyCharlie They're suing them for patent infringement, not copyright infringement.

A reminder that it's a PATENT infringement lawsuit, not a copyright one.

The suit's over patent rights and not copyright. I'm no expert, but that's a curious distinction that makes me wonder what evidence Nintendo and The Pokemon Company found to warrant filing a lawsuit. Especially because this is bound to be met with some backlash, given Palworld's success.

In all seriousness, I hope Nintendo and Pokemon lose this case. Yea, some Pals look like Pokemon. But I could argue some Pokemon look like monsters from other games, like Dragon Quest. Nintendo and Pokemon don't own the idea of a 'monster collecting' game, no matter how much they try to convince us of that.

@BrazillianCara @IceClimbers that just raises even more questions, because I've been under the impression that the characters, although unique, might just be "inspired" enough for copyright. The gameplay and mechanics are pretty darn different from Pokémon games aside from the fact that you summon your Pals from a sphere (but then I feel like that would be copyright infringement, idk).

Well there goes the chances for Palworld on the Switch 2. Kinda surprised Pocketpair didn’t alter some of the more “inspired” designs while the game was hot on the press.

@PepperMintRex The CEO themselves basically said they aren't interested in being original.

Their entire catalogue is derivative.

@IceClimbersMain That would indeed be copyright infringment. Patent infrigment would imply that Nintendo somehow owns the rights to monster-collecting. Basically Nintendo is stating they own the right to the concept.

The fact that the interest in PalWorld genuinely scared them enough to do this despite playing nothing like Pokemon truly shows how much faith they have in the quality of The Pokemon Company's recent releases.

Patent infringement? Well that's unexpected. Nintendo has 3 patents (20240100432, US11782898B2 and US11782898B2) that deal with how Pokémon data is stored and transferred between games and platforms, so that's my guess.

Can someone else take the time to correct all the people making comments about Copyright? I'm sleepy.

@IceClimbers Good luck with that. You will never get a response or correction. Only an ignore and response to others who agree nomatter how wrong.

But thanks for atleast correcting it for other users who will scroll by.

@NINTELDRITCH IMO they were probably waiting for interest in Palworld to cool down so they didn't feed into the hype.

I expect Nintendo to win this, they did the same in the past when Enterbrain tried to rip off Fire Emblem with "Emblem Saga".

I'm surprised it took this long TBH.

@HeadPirate I would, but I gave up trying to do that a long time ago. Too exhausting.

I hope they win, so much people enable indie developers to steal ideas like nothing. Also this is another case of a product being sucessful based on nintendo hate.

This is a long(short) time coming. Good. Get this thing outta here.

@Darkcaptain3 I highly doubt they've patented collecting/catching mons that otherwise they could have sued Bandai as far back as Digimon World 2.

Considering how shameless the Palworld devs were in lifting stuff straight from other games they've bound to overstep their bounds. Pokemon's legitimate competitors have the advantage of actually having their own ideas.

@gardevoir7 no it just takes a long time to get your evidence and research in order to then file a suit.

I’m sure Nintendo has a home field advantage prepared up very nicely to smother any competitor from their country and banking on support from local authority to do it. Power and influence.

@Darkcaptain3

Patent infringement, by necessity, requires you to have a patent. Nintendo doesn't have the patent on creature collection, so ... obviously they can't accuse people of violating a patent that they do not have and that doesn't exist.

They do have 3 patents around data storage and transfer of "objects" in a virtual space that specifically deal with Pokémon; 20240100432, US11782898B2 and US11782898B2. These deal with software and coding techniques, as well as DB infrastructure. If Palworld is using them that's a pretty big deal. It would be like if they stole the code to MS access and used it in their game.

I knew they were giving them enough rope.

@LadyCharlie Let's not forget that the original Pokémon Red/Blue had some shockingly blatant and shameless ripoff designs from Dragon Quest..
Jokers? I don't remember the name, but I know it was a DQ spinoff.

The real shock here is realizing Akira Toriyama was such a heavyweight that he even (unintentionally) helped set off the Pokémon craze.

But I agree, seeing TPC get a black eye over this one would be the best outcome. I have to assume though that they have been taking incredibly long and suing NOW because they think they have an airtight case.

@Shepdawg1 Except it isn cuz they're suing for patent infringement.
Not copyright cuz they didn't steal designs

@LadyCharlie Swing and a miss me lady. Swing and a miss.

@NinChocolate I mean Pocketpair are about as blatant at ripping Pokemon off as Yuzu was at using and encouraging illegal use of an emulator for piracy.

They're going after them because they're low hanging fruit and an easy win to discourage other potential infringers.

@LadyCharlie They aren't patenting the genre? If this were the case then Japanese produced monster collecting games would've ended up having action taken against them as well. Monster Hunter Stories 2 wouldn't have been allowed to be released without Nintendo jumping on them. Neither would Dragon Quest Monsters. There's something very specific here that Pocketpair infringed on mechanic-wise.

@RubyCarbuncle I don't think it's because of "Noisy man kids." Usually Nintendo and TPCi don't go after a game unless they have actual legal grounds to stand on.

@Dr_Lugae Except its a patent infringement not a copyright one. Copying pokemon characters would be a copyright infringement. Copying a concept itself is a patent infringement.

While Nintendo keep busy suing Palworld and the fake Pokemon games, I still keep my eyes on Nexomon 3 development, hoping Nexomon 3 will bring something that Gamefreaks should be aware.

I’m fine with it honestly. Not really a fan of enslaving cute things and giving them guns.

If Nintendo loses this, it would set a bad precedent for them… I am a little surprised that they decided to risk it. But I think the law is less favorable in America for Nintendo on this one, so it is no surprise they filed in Japan.

I'm a (non-practicing) lawyer, and I'd really like to see on what grounds Nintendo is suing Pocketpair before making judgments on how slimy this is, or the merits of Nintendo's case.

My general sentiment with Nintendo's legal team is that the devil tends to be in the details. Even if they're suing Pocketpair on the basis of some sort of game mechanic, I'm 90% certain that they wouldn't have gone after Palworld if the character designs weren't so blatantly copped from Pokemon designs. The monster collecting genre has existed for decades and I'm not aware of any sort of lawsuits Nintendo has filed against Digimon, Monster Rancher, Nexomon, SMT, etc.

People think that Nintendo is trying to hold claim over the Monster Collecting genre as a whole- ignoring the fact that there are several Monster Collecting RPGs on switch that weren't published or produced by Nintendo. Games that were produced in Japan like Palworld- but never lead to Nintendo suing the companies that produced them. Games like:

Ultra Kaiju Monster Rancher

Digimon Story Cyber Sleuth

Monster Hunter Stories

Dragon Quest Monsters

World of Final Fantasy

Persona

Shin Megami Tensei

Also @QiaraIris , the Pal designs would be copyright infringement- which isn't what TPCi is suing for. TPCi is suing for patent infringement, which means something gameplay-mechanic related that specifically got copied from Pokemon.

@Zeldawakening I doubt Nintendo actually wants this to go to court - they're probably angling for a settlement.

Gigantic and disgusting overreach but you get to do that when you have billions of dollars.

Didn't a bunch of the pals have underlying framework and animations that were clearly stolen from Pokemon games?

@Darkcaptain3 I know I'm just saying because Palworld is blatantly copying Pokemon it's more likely to break a patent on a mechanic than any other monster collection game.

I'd wager because you catch Pals by throwing "power balls". The pokeball concept is unique to Pokemon and something other Monster catching games dont use. Except Palworld and its only using it because its ripping Pokemon off.

@ClickBrick But you're fine with enslaving cute things and making them fight each other to the point of being permanently unconscious until/unless they get medical treatment. You know, the medical treatment those wild cute things don't get without being enslaved, which you only can enslave after beating them into submission, meaning every random encounter you KO is effectively a murder?

See how you can word anything to sound bad, and how you shouldn't just do it because you don't like something?

Some of the people portraying PocketPair as the underdog small indie studio taking the fight to AAA publishers is disingenuous at best, they're a company built off an admitted lack of creativity and a drive to chase trends while utilizing the scummiest practices in the industry to try and obtain success.

Supporting them isn't supporting small artists, quite the opposite actually given one of their other titles is all about the use of goddamn AI image generation

We all saw this coming and I'm surprised it took so long tbh 🤣🤣

@Dr_Lugae There are a bunch of other games that do the same thing. Pokemon doesn't own the patent for capturing monsters inside of balls.

@Darkcaptain3 Yeah they do:
https://patents.google.com/patent/JP7545191B1

I'll save you reading through it but here's a snippet:

"The computer
causes a player character in a virtual space to take a stance to release a capture item when a first category group including a plurality of types of capture items for capturing a field character placed on a field in a virtual space is selected based on an operation input of pressing an operation button, and causes a player character in the virtual space to take a stance to release the capture item when a second category group including a plurality of types of combat characters that engage in combat is selected, and determines an aiming direction in the virtual space based..."

@JalapenoSpiceLife

You saw it coming that Nintendo would get the source code for Palword and determine that the coding techniques around database management, content data holding, storage medium, and content data holding servers violated patents 20240100432, US11782898B2 and US11782898B, while not making any copyright claim around it's similarity to Pokémon?

DANM dude, you need to pick me some lottery numbers.

(Haha, sorry to call you out, it was just too tempting. Please forgive me)

Jeez, patents for basic gameplay ideas are such insufferable cringe. ***** off Nintendo with your stifling bull.

EDIT: Provided that the PocketPair didn't steal code from Nintendo, as @HeadPirate is speculating may be the case.

Nintendo at it again huh. In other news, water is wet.

@Dr_Lugae

In the simplest terms (and keeping in mind I am way to tired to fully review 250 pages of patent applications), it looks like Nintendo owns patents around how a database stores creature data, how that data is transferred between clients, and a bunch of server logic based around it. It's pretty rudimentary stuff, and if I was to guess based off playing Palworld, I think the claim is going to be against the way in which the game handles instances in multiplayer.

That's basically a guess though. A sorta educated guess, but still a guess.

Can we get some transparency into WHAT patents they may have broke? Not very clear from the article alone...

If this was for Copyright I'd be entirely in PalWorld's favor - two people can make similar things with the same source inspiration. But since it's for patents I'm curious. It's gotta be something super specific that you'd never think was patented in the first place, and it'd be hard to think this won't end with an out of court settlement... unless they're that insecure about the current state of Pokemon. Unless they can prove something damning it's just gonna be bad PR no matter the outcome.

@Kingy

Yeah patents of game play mechanics would be pretty cringe, which is probably why you can not and never have been able to file for them.

The patents in question here are pretty hardcore coding patents around database management, simultaneous server quarries, and object management within a virtual space.

Look I understand strong options, but you should really try to inform your opinions before you make comments like that. They are accusing Palword of stealing proprietary code and libraries, which is a pretty indefensible act even if you try to see this as "big bad company" vs the underdog. This has nothing at all to do with any similarities to Pokémon.

I've compared this game's attempts to skirt the lines of plagiarism to poking a bear before. I don't think they deserve to get mauled for it, but going into it expecting anything else would be idiotic. Hopefully they get out with a few scratches and learn to play nice like all the other creature collectors.

@shoeses Nintendo buries people under lawsuits just cus even when they are in the wrong. They have enough money to do this stuff and win just on the fact the other person can't pay to get out of the lawsuit. Youtubers have this happen all the time thanks to them.

Well that was certainly a twist. The distinction of patent lawsuit is particularly interesting. I would have to guess Nintendo has info that we don't, cause they wouldn't have gone for this unless they could win. It the alternative is this is a bully lawsuit. The reason for waiting may have been they wanted to strike while their opponents were down, as it seems Palworld hasn't been doing great lately. Regardless, I am fascinated to see how this plays out

@RubyCarbuncle I mean there's a reason PETA always uses wording like that and no one likes PETA, right?

@HeadPirate Im amazed. Even tired you're making an effort to inform everyone. Really, I mean that. It's good so others will know exactly what's going on here.

@gardevoir7 pokemon and dragon quest their own art styles.... Pal worlds creatures look very close to the point you can line models up and they 89% match up ....

@LadyCharlie They didn't patent monster collecting, obviously that's not what this is about. There are tons of games with such mechanics.
You should wait until you know what actual patents were infringed upon before making such statements.

@NINTELDRITCH Randomly? It takes time to actually collect evidence and data before you can make a lawsuit.

Its about Time moral of story
don’t be a copycat It’s great to get creative ideas but that took the cake all the way

@Lady_rosalina That would be a copyright claim then, not a patent infringement.

If they stole those models, they are screwed. 🤷🏾‍♂️

@DripDropCop146

I really appreciate that. I'm really curious myself as to what's happening, so I made a nice cup of tea and hit the books. Might as well make what comments I can before my brain shuts off.

@Dr_Lugae entertainment mediums are rife with ‘ripping off’. No amount of brand loyalty should stifle the best from existing, and clearly many knockoffs have survived the courts.

Obviously the Pokémon brand is an emotional affair for a lot of people and protectiveness comes in tow

@HeadPirate Yeah that stuff would make sense thanks.

I guess we'll find out for sure once it's all done since Nintendo are claiming infringement on multiple patents.

@Anachronism personally I think they deserve it because not only is it blatant.

The game itself and the company are Early Access scammers. They release games in early access, promise road maps, don't deliver and then announce another open world crafting game for early access cash.

Their previous game Craftopia is still in early access, and their game before that was abandoned for Craftopia. If they get sued into oblivion the games industry would be better off for it.

.

Palworld shined for a glorious 15 minutes of ginormous, unrivaled popularity, but has since fallen from grace into relative obscurity. Game was already failing by not having much of a player base anymore, but this will be the finishing blow. I can't say as I'm surprised about them being sued, or that I didn't see this coming, but still.

@Snatcher It's a patent infringement lawsuit. We don't know what patents those are yet. The lawsuit has nothing to do with visual designs of the Pals or the catching mechanics.

@eaglebob345 The lawsuit is not about the models anyways. They didn't patent models.

@BodkinDQ That's not very fair. Palworld is still consistently hitting 30k daily players on Steam alone, about the same as Gmod. It's definitely not as popular as it was when it came out, but it's certainly not dead yet.

It’s really annoying/disheartening seeing yet ANOTHER lawsuit from Nintendo. Like, the game isn’t setting the world on fire anymore. I get not putting up having your copyright trampled or whatever. But why risk bad PR when their console is right around the corner.

This company makes my brain hurt sometimes, lol.

You can't patent an art style or a gameplay mechanic without using some type of legal loophole or abusing an old set of laws that were never updated for Modern Times and the digital age.

it was rumored palworld was coming to the ps5..

@Shepdawg1 It's absolutely definitely not about plagiarized creature designs as it's a patent lawsuit and not about copyright.

@LadyCharlie Your comment makes zero sense. You're going on about how they shouldn't be allowed to patent genres but nobody ever even did. Like what are you even talking about? Nonsense.

@gardevoir7 I remember the creator making a comment on the game having a dying player base, but was just happy so many people played it and that they'd come back eventually in bittersweet comment.

I personally don't look at Steam player counts, just going by the developer as my source. 🤷‍♂️

Really want to post my opinion but don't really want to start a argument with anyone so I'll just say I saw this coming.

@urbanman2004 And why is that? Why are you convinced that they are in the wrong here? Do you know which patents were infringed upon? Or are you just being reactive and hate Nintendo?

In case you didn't know: Pocket Pair is not the great "little guy" company that is being bullied by the evil corporation here. They are scammers who make early access games with false promises of update roadmaps, never finish them and then just abandon them for the next one. And they never have even the slightest bit of creativity in their games.

I want to quote @Itachi here:
"Some of the people portraying PocketPair as the underdog small indie studio taking the fight to AAA publishers is disingenuous at best, they're a company built off an admitted lack of creativity and a drive to chase trends while utilizing the scummiest practices in the industry to try and obtain success.

Supporting them isn't supporting small artists, quite the opposite actually given one of their other titles is all about the use of goddamn AI image generation."

@Shepdawg1 If it was because of its a monster catcher, why haven't Nintendo gone after SMT or MH Stories?

@PepperMintRex Read the article. This is not about copyright.

@BTB20 Ah ok. Well I do hope whatever the patient is it’s a fair one to sue over.

I shall refrain my statement about it till we know the reason then.

Better call Saul

@HeadPirate Fair enough, I may have jumped the gun there. My mind immediately went to stuff like WB's nemesis system and Namco putting a patent on loading screen minigames and assumed this was a similar case.
Should have waited until we knew more about what patents exactly the Palworld devs are accused of infringing on.

@HeadPirate Thank you for this information. What is DB infrastructure if you don't mind me asking?

Also I mentioned you on PureXbox since I used your information. Hope you don't mind.

@BTB20 That is true. I googled patents held by Nintendo and the Pokémon Company. Nintendo has so many.

If they waited this long they might have found something worth fighting over, we know they had their eyes on Palworld from day one.

Some Palworld designs are virtually carbon copies of Pokemon designs. There's "inspired by", and then there's plagiarism. I know Nintendo & Pokemon can be pretty strong-armed when it comes to their IP, but they do have a right to protect their assets. Stealing is not cool.

@LadyCharlie Now that's just silly. And I mean really silly. Sadly I can't use a more appropriate word , but still... Relishing in being wrong rather than showing abit of humility is not very mature.

The commenters here have been very kind in trying to tell you that your comment is incorrect, not just for your sake, but others who might not fully grasp what this lawsuit is about.

You are not being helpful right now when you can be.

@BodkinDQ I'm pretty sure that was just their community manager who said that not the actual creator considering he's got a pretty cynical view on gaming and creativity.

https://www.gamefile.news/p/palworld-pocketpair-takuro-mizobe-interview

Like he unironically prides himself on not creating anything original:

“I always think: To make new things is very hard.

“In game development, of course, sometimes we have to do it, but, as much as possible, I try to avoid creating new things.”

Like it's unsurprising a guy with an outlook like he has is getting sued for infringement when he's purposely avoiding creating anything new.

@Dr_Lugae

"Multiple patent rights" could mean violations of different systems contained within the same Patent. 20240100432 has 18 unique and individual systems, for example.

It's also pretty interesting that they have only filed in Tokyo, given parent enforcement is regional. It's dated the 18th, which was "Yesterday" in Japan, so they have had a full day to make a similar filing in the US but haven't done so.

There might be some complexity around multinationals I'm not considering though.

@HeadPirate My guess is that they're targeting the IV system, which Palworld absolutely did copy. Those IV's are stored alongside the data of the Pokemon/Pals. Perhaps maybe even the way Shiny monsters are spawned, because that's data too. Even breeding is the same. They have many angles to attack from.

IV system is what my money is on though. It's a very unique system to the Pokemon franchise.

@urbanman2004 Did you even read what I wrote? That Pocket Pair CEO is an actual scumbag. But I'm a shill because I dare to actually think for myself instead of behaving like a sheep.

@Kingy

Just wanted to give you a shout out for being so reasonable. You're right, there are a LOT of bad actors when it comes to patent lawsuits, but in this case I think it's safe to assume Nintendo's patent is legitimate and not overly broad. Generally the really questionable lawsuits come from Nintendo of America. Nintendo Co., Ltd. is typically a lot more reserved, and given it's a joint filing with The Pokémon Company, a lot of people had to greenlight this. Nintendo isn't a majority shareholder, meaning either Creatures or Game Freak has to think it was a valid suit as well.

Excellent, it was about time they sue them, the plagiarism is shameless, i hope nintendo gets justice and a lot of money. Palworld devs should be worried. Because Nintendo legal team is the best. This will show them that you cannot copy other peoples work and talent and expect no consequences

@gardevoir7 nintendo is gonna win, they always win when they know they have a case. And xome on, the palworld monsters are a copy of pokemon. You just wont accept it

@anoyonmus

I don't mind at all, in fact I shouldn't have used an abbreviation there. DB is database, and Database infrastructure refers to the unique ways different systems handle tables and queries. If you don't want to pay Microsoft for use of SQL, you have to code all that from the ground up without infringing on THEIR patents It is a monumental task.

@Itachi2099 you are right, they are shameless talentless thieves. They deserve to lose a lot of money to nintendo

@Axecon damn right. People here are just used to get things for free and fight capitalism and big.companies, they are kids that dont understand basic moral, ergo stealing is bad

@HeadPirate I am a massive idiot, and I appreciate your summaries/speculations on what could be happening with this. The peak of my brainpower is "nintendo stupid wtf are they doing"-- not going to figure out much myself.

@winnchu253

As good a guess as any. To be clear, you can't patent the IV system as a game mechanic, but some of the patents Nintendo does hold would likely apply to how that information is stored and passed between systems.

When they were developing the patent system, a question they struggled with was card games. What if you played a slight variation of poker with someone and thought it was so good you filed for a patent for whatever gameplay difference made it unique. Does that mean that no card game, even one that isn't poker, can use that machinic without violating your patent? And if it didn't, what's to stop you from just filing multiple patents for it's use in every card game you can think of, basically doing the same thing? And wait a minute, poker is an existing work, so you can't patent a variation of it ... but wouldn't that also mean that any "card game" is derivate of card games in general? When is your card game unique enough that you can patent it?

In the end, they decided that it just wasn't viable to allow for any gameplay mechanic to be eligible for a patent. Look at Pathfinder and D&D 3rd edition. They are IDENTICAL, and it's fine. The only thing Pathfinder needed to do was change the names of classes and creatures as to not violate any copyrights D&D held. This is why board games and UNO exist ... you could patent the unique boards and the card themselves, even if you can't patent the gameplay.

@LadyCharlie A+ comment, and are you doing something new with your avatar? Keep it up, girl!

Always fascinating to me how much Nintendo/Pokemon hatefulness comes out of the woodworks, on a Nintendo website no less. Even worse that so much of the negativity is ignorant, emotional ranting. Disappointing to say the least. Pocket Pair is the last company people should be defending.

@mother_brain_85 They aren't suing for copyright infringement

@Elbow

Nah, you're probably a really intelligent person who hasn't had the luxury of a lifetime in academia. Knowing stuff doesn't make you smart, and not knowing stuff doesn't make you an idiot. It's just a measurer of how you spend your free time.

Surprised it took this long.

Good! Give 'em heck!!

Rightfully so, too.

The game has been walking on a very tight rope so yeah not shocked and i hope Nintendo win this one.

@Dr_Lugae I think your interpretation on his quote is a bit uncharitable. Here's a larger piece of that interview:

He wanted to show me what he made. The game, called The Tentai Show, is an arcade-style shooting game for the Nintendo DS. It challenges players to stop meteoroids that are hurtling toward a planet that is positioned where the system’s dual screens meet.

Mizobe wanted me to notice that the game used both of the DS’ screens for gameplay, a contrast with how most DS games treated one screen as its main gameplay view and used the other for support functions.

“Nintendo wanted students to create a new game,” he said. “So I learned how to create a new game and think in a unique style of game development.”

Had he learned any lessons from working with Nintendo that stuck with him years later?

“Kind of,” he said with a laugh. “I always think: To make new things is very hard.

“In game development, of course, sometimes we have to do it, but, as much as possible, I try to avoid creating new things.”

You like to mix and match, I suggested, thinking back to 2021, when I’d last interviewed Mizobe.

“Yes,” he replied.

:I understand that him and his team are involved in one controversy after the next about copying others people's work, but this is a pretty normal way to operate when creating something yourself. The majority of your ideas are going to be repurposed from the menagerie of things that inspire you, and typically you give those ideas a twist by combining them with others or having something new thrown in with it, that's just how people work.
Whether or not something is a copy of another is a matter of execution, and with that in mind, Palworld at the end of the day is clearly a distinct game from its inspirations through the combination of its inspirations. Which is exactly how most things - especially video games - are in certain degrees.

This isn't to defend anything Pocketpair may have done in infringing on Nintendo's patents, it's just to point out that that quote isn't really as damning to his character as you think it is.

How about instead of filing a lawsuit over a 9 month old game, Nintendo puts more budget into Game Freak so we can get good Pokémon games again?

Lmao some of the comments in that other recent article with the last Pokemon bootleg clone aged horribly already.

I can agree with headpirate here.

@LadyCharlie patent infrightment and copyright infrightment are different things

Guys, Nintendo strategically timed filing this lawsuit today to distract us from the Switch 2 leaks! The evil geniuses!!

The more I think about it the more this sounds like it's out of pettiness. "Suing for damages"? For who, their egos, the bad quality of the Pokemon games? You know how many ridiculous loops you'd have to go through to prove someone was going to buy a Pokemon game, but instead bought PalWorld, a game sold on completely different Platforms, which also means they either were going to buy a Switch or bought one of said Platforms for it specifically, and that if specifically PalWorld didn't exist they'd have bought those things at that time? And then prove that specific scenario happened enough times to make it worth the time and legal fees? Unless they did something wild like straight up ripped the coding from a Pokemon game, this feels like Nintendo going, "It's not always about the money Spider-Man".

@EriXz Yeah, no hope there. There's a deleted comment "I stand behind my statement". So, I think it's clear there is no care.

@Ulysses Somehow this makes more sense than most other possibilities lol

@HeadPirate Sifted through the patents and this might be it: 20200398165. Specifically:

"In the case of determining a parameter of a content used in the game on the basis of the available environment information, the game system 1 according to the present embodiment may determine a parameter at a predetermined event. For example, when the content is a character and the parameter is a power of the character (e.g., a power such as an attack power or a defense power used in a battle in a game), the game system 1 may determine the power of the character on the basis of the available environment information each time a predetermined event starts. Note that the event may be, for example, a battle between characters.

In this case, the parameter storage unit 320 stores the character ID of the character and the power point serving as a parameter of the character in association with the available environment information. Then, the game progress unit 20 can make progress of the game using the power point of the character determined by the parameter determination unit 14 on the basis of the available environment information acquired by the available environment information acquisition unit 12."

Patent Lawsuit?, the only thing that will happen is that: either some small change will be made to the game Palworld, and/or there will simply be some "deal", where possibly this game will end up on the Switch 2.

In my opinion and as it has been seen, Nintendo nor the Pokémon company had any interest in this game, come on, there are many 'legal' games that take certain elements from Pokémon and they have not been sued.; They simply "pleased" what some "fans" insisted on, and well, it was done, but only to avoid a conflict.
If Nintendo and Pokemon had any interest, almost immediately since more was known about the game, there would have been a lawsuit, knowing how Nintendo is, that simple

Now all the little kids or man-children who cried that Palworld is bad can rejoice if Nintendo wins. Seriously I saw so many complaints on every video that even mentioned the game. It's either a dead game cried the Pokéshills or it's getting sued to high heaven, pick one fanboys.

I just knew it was a matter of time, first a Nintendo music extension channel gets terminated, a user I followed on YouTube that focused Zelda ToTK mods gets terminated, I see some supposed "Switch 2" specs on Twitter & YouTube earlier today, now Palworld is being tossed under a semi-truck called the law.

That's a weirdly fulfilling day because it's bad stuff plus a huge rumor.

This thread is definitely going to get locked soon. Hopefully we get more details soon.

Dragonquest on the side just rubbing their hands at same time thinking OH YOU GUNNA SUE PALWORLD FOR COPYING *****.

As much as I love Nintendo, they will LOSE this. It will hurt their reputation as a gaming company.

Patents can include processes, systems and more - from the coding to the visuals of any game. It can be very dry and boring details gamers never think of. Until more details are available, I reserve my judgement on this case. Patent infringement is serious and shouldn’t be dismissed without careful consideration.

@LadyCharlie Nintendo has more money, Nintendo will win.

@eaglebob345 True, but please give a like to @HeadPirate comments. They as well as others have done an admirable job.

Come mornin, the ol' battle axe is coming and alot of comments are on the chopping block.

I'm gonna file this under the "Oh no! Anyway..." category, because personally I don't really care either way who wins. Nintendo and especially TPC need to learn a lesson on their shoddy development of pokémon games and losing here could hopefully give them that lesson. Pocketpair also needs a lesson on not blatantly copying someone else's homework.

But I'm personally just a simple consumer. I see product I like, I buy. If I don't like product, I skip. And I've skipped both Palworld and any pokémon game after the Let's Go games. So yeah, I don't really care much.

I don't think nintendo can patent an idea, but maybe what they sue is the characters/creatures since some of palworld creatures really looks like creatures from the pokemon games.

The game is blatently leeching off Pokemon. Everyone knows it. Not sure why some folk are being so dense about it.

@shoeses I have literally never played a Pokémon game in my life. Your comment has showed me I wasn’t missing out on much. Thanks very much for the insight. Why does everyone play this!?

I call bs. This game sold like 30 million units within months and they got afraid cause non-Nintendo gamers were jumping on it. I see no copyright infringement but a few similarities though.

In the criminal justice system, patent infringements are considered especially heinous. In Tokyo, the dedicated detectives who investigate these vicious felonies are members of an elite squad known as the Super Effective Unit. These are their stories...

Also, Pokémon Plaintiff and Pokémon Defendant confirmed for late 2025.

Pokémon Legends Witness Protection to follow in 2026.

I doubt this is going to be seen by most of the people but to those finding it weird or ridiculous that they took this long it's actually a reasonable time frame considering they had to sit down with their lawyers and also come through everything of the game for what would infringe and what could be considered infringement. It also comes to the fact that if they would have did it within the first week it came out they would have had a relatively weak case and as such they should now have enough evidence of anything that they are trying to sue their grounds upon. As some people have said this is a patent not copyright so in this case it could be some of the programming within the game and not just because of something that could lead to Pokemon itself it could be any kind of possible data or management kind of patent that Nintendo or the Pokemon company have we will end up seeing what it is exactly as it gets started up but this could end up taking a long time.

People have a hard time understanding that taking models from one game and modifying them for another and selling them is a crime. It's a win-win case.

@Brianst0rm this isn't copyright infringement. Its PATENT infringement. Read the article more carefully.

@Arawn93 Was thinking the same. Aged very quickly too.

@GrailUK They named their company Pocketpair... how people are not seeing that the likeness to Pokemon is very much intentional is beyond me.

Not saying it means they crossed legal lines in my eyes, just saying the blatancy is a feature, not a coincidence.

@Vexx234 yeah, i mean, it's a confusing behavior since this is a Nintendo news site, kinda like: what are you even doing here?
Every brand has a right to defend their intellectual property as they see fit. Granted, even I don't share Nintendo's practices every now and then but have to respect their right to manage their business the way they want.

Okay this one I can’t support. This is a huge disgrace for both Pokemon and Nintendo. Filing a patent suit against Palworld is sad, petty and downright abusive behaviour.

This makes me question giving either company more money. It’s that ***** up to me. Copyright suits I have no problem with. But this is unacceptable behaviour especially given the nature of how Palworld plays and functions so differently from anything either company has produced. You should not be able to patent individual game mechanics and systems.

Shameful.

They blatantly ripped off some pokemon designs so Nintendo have every right to take them to court. This case should also bring to light if they used AI for their designs or not.

@UltimateOtaku91 Read the article! It’s not about designs (they have no legal ground to stand on there), it’s about patents. Things like gameplay system, mechanics, etc.

This is a really bad precedent case if Nintendo wins because it means now any mega corp can own game mechanics and individual concepts. In what world is that ok?

Patents mean methods, not the end result like copyright is meant to protect. Patents I think also use include trade secrets or encryption, my opinion is that though palworld is questionable, they exploited the law just enough to avoid copyright, but if somebody on the team copied trade secrets or encryption keys... first why tf would you copy that if you can code, second they deserve it 100 % if so instead of 80%... If it's code or mechanics... Good luck getting that to stick, code is copyright, and mechanics don't fall under copyright , trademarks, or patents as far as I know

From Wikipedia:
A patent is a type of intellectual property that gives its owner the legal right to exclude others from making, using, or selling an invention for a limited period of time in exchange for publishing an enabling disclosure of the invention.[1] In most countries, patent rights fall under private law and the patent holder must sue someone infringing the patent in order to enforce their rights

@RygelXVIII If it's about gameplay systems and mechanics then I don't know what that could be as it plays nothing like Pokémon.

We all knew this day would come. Nintendo's lawyers must spend so much time in court.

@UltimateOtaku91 It would be things like throwing balls to collect monsters, using gliders, storing monsters in a “palbox”, breeding and inhering traits, things like that. We don’t know for sure yet of course but I can’t think of what else it could be. Comment above yours mentions encryption keys but that just doesn’t make sense in this case because it’s not a romhack or modification of an existing executable.

I'm amazed how many people have opinions on patent infringement without knowing anything over the claim. Like Nintendo aren't saying because its the subject of an ongoing legal dispute.
It could be that Palworld is completely innocent or they could be extremely guilty of infringement.
It's interesting Nintendo spent months obviously looking into it and they must think they found something there.
You'd think if just trying to Bury Palworld would have taken a case when it was popular and new.

@Roibeard64 Well they announced it on their website themselves, so can’t blame us for having to digest that with limited data.

I may change my opinion when the case details come out, but patent infringement for videogames is usually extremely destructive to the industry and a shameful use of patent laws. That’s my default opinion based on past experiences. Nintendo is the one having to prove it’s otherwise.

@RygelXVIII Hmm, I've played a lot of monster collecting games from Digimon, Dragon Quest Monsters, Tem Tem, World of FF and Cassette Beasts and most of those things you mentioned are in those games. Surely there should be some more info on this soon, but for me personally if it's not about the creature designs then I don't see Nintendo winning this case.

@LadyCharlie Totally get that. However they didn’t sue Digimon, Monster Rancher, Jade Cocoon or any of those to my knowledge and they’re monster collecting/battling games.

The theory on reddit is the patent is specifically about the Legends: Arceus catch system. And possibly the mount system or glider from BotW.

Thing is, the catch system already existed in the Palword Dev's earlier game, Craftopia. Which released years before Legends: Arceus. So either Japan never heard of that game, or it's a patent reddit hasn't found yet.

@LadyCharlie "I want the Pokémon Company to lose so badly.
You can't patent or copyright a concept, you can't patent or own an idea."

You clearly do not understand what a patent is, do you? A patent is an exclusive document describing a technology. Meaning an idea. So "you can't patent an idea"? It's the only thing you can patent!!

You can't own a genre, since a genre officially (for the law) does not exist. It's only something gamers invented to categorise games. Certain mechanics in those games can absolutely be patented and owned. Same as copyrighted materials.

And I am 100% sure Nintendo has a very strong suit here. They actively develop games that use these patents. So they are required (by law) to defend them.

If you don't like that Nintendo / TPC does this, you need to look at the governments to change these legislations. Not at Nintendo for abiding them. Same goes for copyrights, same goes for anti piracy and same goes for trademarks.

Good riddance to bad rubbish.

@Twilite9 If you'd played Palworld you realise the only thing it has in common with Pokemon is spheres being used to catch monsters, and some similarities in monster designs — and this isn't a copyright suit so it's not about the latter. Everything else plays entirely unlike any Pokemon game ever made. I've played it extensively, and I've played every Pokemon game. You should stop having strong opinions on things you have no knowledge about.

I think it’s fair to say that Nintendo don’t own the whole concept of collecting monsters for battle. I think its also fair to say that Pal World get very close to the bone with a lot of design elements and Nintendo definitely have a case to pursue with patents- just like they’re doing.

Pokémon is their second biggest franchise. They are going to do what they can to protect its unique elements.

The problem for palworld is some of the designs were almost complete copies of Pokemon, and they featured on the box art. Look at the Lucario ripoff, for example. I'm sure Nintendo will win on that alone, especially given the case is being held in a Japanese court: a jurisdiction with a wide remit for copyright law.

@Twilite9 What does working in the creative industries have to do with not knowing how Palworld actually plays? I'm a senior software engineer, which is more relevant, yet I don't mention that because it's not relevant to understanding the differences between Palworld and Pokemon games.

So let me list it to you as someone who has actually dozens of hours in Palworld.

• Palworld is a realtime action game, where the player character uses melee and ranged weapons and their chosen pal companion fights autonomously by their side.
• Let me reiterate: Palworld isn't turn-based. You don't directly command your pals.
• You don't command your pals. All have one special move you can trigger on a cooldown whichc an vary and often requires the player to own specific equipment. Gloves to hold a fire aspect monster as a flamethrower, for example.
• You can build and create bases, placing individual walls, ceilings, manufacturing facilities etc. Pals can use these if they have the corresponding skillsets.
• Pals move about the base and perform tasks autonomously.
• Fights are never between your pal and another pal; it's between the player character and other characters or pals, with or without pals of their own.
• Bases built incur dynamic raids you must defend against or have them destroyed.

And on and on. There's more in common with Palworld and Conan Exiles than there is between it and any Pokemon game.

Will be interesting to see which patents Nintendo is suing for.

Smart move for them to wait until interest in the game has died down. Will be far less backlash from communities.

Not the announcement I was waiting for by Nintendo though.

Does anyone want anything from the shops?

@Liam_Doolan

"Palworld allegedly "infringes multiple patent rights""

"Nintendo Co., Ltd. (HQ: Kyoto, Minami-ku, Japan; Representative Director and President: Shuntaro Furukawa, “Nintendo” hereafter), together with The Pokémon Company, filed a patent infringement lawsuit in the Tokyo District Court against Pocketpair, Inc. (HQ: 2-10-2 Higashigotanda, Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo, “Defendant” hereafter) on September 18, 2024."

Would you consider adding a little information about patents and the companies involved to the article?

The parent organizations of The Pokemon Company (founded 1998) are:
Nintendo (founded 1889)
Game Freak (founded 1989)
Creatures (founded 1995)

Patents are granted by country or region, but:
"PCT – The International Patent System
By filing one international patent application under the PCT, applicants can simultaneously seek protection for an invention in a large number of countries."
World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO)
https://www.wipo.int

The Pokemon Company owns quite a few patents.
Justia.com lists 59 patents:
https://patents.justia.com/assignee/the-pokemon-company

Nintendo patents:
https://patents.justia.com/assignee/nintendo-co-ltd

Game Freak patents:
https://patents.justia.com/assignee/game-freak-inc

Creatures patents:
https://patents.justia.com/assignee/creatures-inc

A couple of japanese patent sites:
https://www.jpo.go.jp
https://www.j-platpat.inpit.go.jp

As the lawsuit is filed in Japan, it will probably focus on Japanese patents.

Seeing this isn't a knee here reaction, I would guess Ninty has done their homework and think they can win.

They haven't gone after Astro Bot and that's got a lot of Nintendo DNA in it.

It's interesting that it's based on patent infringement and not IP infringement given every Palworld character I've seen is clearly two or three Pokemon clumsily smashed together.

Oh well. I'd like Palworld's existence and popularity to give Game Freak a kick to do better. But also Palworld's blatant use of Pokemon aesthetics goes beyond parody and doesn't sit well with me.

@MrGawain Astro Bot is in no way near enough to any Nintendo IP to warrant any legal actions. It's just a well made 3D platformer which has some things like a hover jump and some similar but mechanically different power ups that Mario and other platformer games also have.

The comparisons to things like Splatoon, Arms and Pikmin were such a laughable stretch.

@NINTELDRITCH It is not random, it takes time to make a proper case, especially if they actually do have legitimate arguments and it is not just a haphazard kneejerk reaction.

I don't think they'll win this one. But I'm no lawyer so who knows

The amount of people everywhere confusing patent infringement with copyright is alarming.

Now I'm no big city lawyer

(everyone gasps)

But it seems to me that this lawsuit goes deeper than the surface level "Palworld looks just like Pokémon" story that has been at the forefront of pretty much all Palworld coverage since the game was announced. If that was Nintendo's case, then surely

1. It would've gone after every creature collecting game under the sun. Palworld, Cassette Beasts, Nexomon, Coromon, TemTem, etc.
2. It wouldn't have taken this long for Nintendo to pursue legal action against PocketPair.

Patent infringement, to me anyway, implies that there's something else going on. Maybe it's the actual stealing and modification of Pokémon in-game assets? Maybe it goes even deeper; maybe there's code that was lifted from Pokémon games?

Again, I'm no game developer and I'm no lawyer, but I don't believe that Nintendo would've taken this long to file a lawsuit against PocketPair for the kind of surface level stuff that people are assuming.

I think they are afraid that : If palworld comes to switch the game is gonna be so popular that they stop playing pokemon until the new legends game is out next year
And maybe nintendo has nothing new planned for pokemon to release until pokemon legend Z-A is out and there afraid everyone is gonna play palworld on the switch

Boy I really want Nintendo to win.
As for everyone trying to convince the "charlie user" that the comment that person made is misinformed: save your breath, that person always leaves horrible bad takes to bait others and never replies to valid arguments.
Surprised nobody realised that yet.

All the armchair patent and copyright lawyers in the comments. 🤣
They have been investigating since January so maybe wait and see what evidence The Pokémon Company & Nintendo have found, before falling over yourselves trying to mount a defence for Palworld. 🤷🏿‍♀️

Idk what’s going to happen with this whole lawsuit but I’m pretty sure that Nintendo wouldn’t sue if they didn’t have grounds to do so . However what’s blatantly clear judging by the comment section is that nowadays reading comprehension is way less important than outrage.

@Hyrule Lawyer Smaryer. We here in the comments got our degree from the streets. Take that law school!

Since Sony created Pal world entertainment with Pocket pair, this means Nintendo is suing Sony. This should be interesting

Just to clarify a lot of misconceptions here...

1) This is a patent infringement accusation, not copyright. That means it has nothing to do with the designs or intellectual property.

2) Nintendo and TPC have a vast, broad and vague array of patents they could theoretically use against any studio they wanted. Palworld was only singled out because of its (still legally distinct) similarities.

3) Nintendo are banking on PocketPair giving into their demands, which would work out much cheaper than dragging the case out in court for years to come. Even if Nintendo lost, the legal fees incurred by PocketPair would end up worse than if they capitulate. Unfortunately, the legal system is all about who has the deepest pockets.

They want Palworld gone, or at the very least they want a slice of that pie. They have no legal basis to do this, so have resorted to patent trolling.

Patents huh? Ironic when "patently" Nintendo have had for many years had trouble producing a Pokemon game that that is anywhere near as fun as Palworld

A lot of people enjoyed Palworld, and are unhappy with the quality of recent Pokémon games.

Still, that sentiment does not justify breaking any laws. I hope whoever is right, wins. That's what is ultimately best for consumers.

Next up: the animal kingdom sues Pokémon

Why did they take so long to do this?
Let people become fans of this game and now go after it?
Sorry but whatever happens Nintendo is going to come off the back of this worse off.
They Win - They ruin a lot of peoples gaming time on this game
They Lose - Opens up for others
No win situation, should have tried to of stopped it when it first came out

@RygelXVIII in both scarlet/violet and legends arceus the battles aren't exclusively turn based either.
in both you can send out your pokemon to fight against wild pokemon autonomously.
pokemon legends arceus also specifically has player vs creature combat mechanics, where the player character needs to avoid attacks and attack directly(using thrown projectiles)

@thedicemaster Fair. Still very simplistic compared to what Palworld is doing on that front. If Nintendo wins on patents related to that (see below) it's bad for everyone.

https://patents.justia.com/patent/20240278129

Party's over, pal(world.)

I'm sure they'll manage to wiggle their way out of this somehow, even if it means dropping a feature or two from the game. Reminds me of the nonsense with WB (I think) patenting the Nemesis System from those LoTR games. A super cool feature being held hostage by a company that probably won't ever do anything with it again. Wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo got the idea from that in the first place.

@Bunkerneath The only reasonable answer as to why they took so long is that they probably pored over everything and checked as much as they could. They wanted as solid of a case as possible. Or, if you want a more cynical take, waited until they were safely rolling in all that cash so Nintendo could come and try to vacuum it up.

I personally hope Pocketpair comes out unscathed, but we don't know what exactly Nintendo is suing for, so maybe it will actually be something justified.

(Also, if you scroll up in the comments, you can find a ton of comments by HeadPirate who was doing a lot of sleuthing last night into the situation. Very informative stuff!)

@RygelXVIII and thats including nintendo.

Has there been any information about what specific patents they're infringing on yet, or is that still something that we have to wait for more details about the case to be revealed later for?

Internet legal experts came right out the gate on this one. Funny thing is Nintendo and TPC can go in with a losing case and still use their unlimited resources to bury these guys in legal fees and make their lives miserable the more they fight it. If they're smart they'll settle early. Fun world we live in.

@PikaPhantom I agree, the patent angle is unexpected but interesting. If Nintendo’s lawyers opted for that route, I imagine they must think they have a strong case. We’ll have to see what the details are, but it’s an interesting development.

Damages? Can they claim that after making bank on a faulty product?

A bit of context here. Nintendo is suing Palworld for patent infringement, what this means is that Nintendo claims that Palworld is using patented game mechanics or technological innovations originally developed by Nintendo, such as systems related to capturing, battling, or evolving creatures. FYI, patent infringement focuses on the functional and technical aspects of the game, rather than its creative elements like characters or storylines.

@slampog the major rumour floating around is the patent surrounding the Poké Ball/capture mechanic, which is near-identical in Palworld to how it functions in Pokémon (throw the ball to catch it, the Pal/Pokémon live inside it, throw it again to unleash them from it).

honestly
sue them
sue them all

If Nintendo's success against Yuzu is any indication, Nintendo is definitely willing to be patient and build a strong case, since that lawsuit wasn't filed until Yuzu was out for several years.

A lot of Nintendo haters who were gloating about how Nintendo can't sue are eating crow right now. Hope Nintendo wins so they get to eat crow again.

Seriously, i think this is just Nintendo trying to scare them. Nintendo doesnt really have a case.
And even, (even) of they would win this, gamefreak also could be in trouble. Their Creatures also look similar to other creatures from other games.
Nintendo doesnt really have a case here.
So if palworld devs need some legal advice, glad.
Dont trow in the towel. You guys created an amazing game. Gamefreak should be sued for the buggy crap they delivered recently 😂. Bugss gonna catch em all.

I mean this also isn't necessarily just against Palworld, the same developers have other games where they reused assets from breath of the wild and other games, so it may not be as specific as it seems against Palworld alone.

Ahh, Crony capitalism at its finest.

If Nintendo is suing because they think they own the "RPG monster-collecting genre", Dragon Quest would like a word.

In fact, Game Freak was inspired by Dragon Quest to make Pokemon!

@sanderev People keep forgetting though that Nintendo isn’t the only one to have patented video game gameplay mechanics. And whether you think that is scummy or not, it is legal.

EA, Sega, Namco have done this to name a few. And ofc there is WB games notorious patent for something called the Nemesis System.

@TheAzure okay yeah I did hear that in a comment.

Some people think it might not be a patent from Pokémon. Reason why people think it is related to Pokemon since the TPC is involved in it. But I did hear the BOTW and TOTK mechanic theory as well.

A former Pocketpair Employee said they were instructed to plagiarise by the CEO

https://x.com/eb_kemo/status/1836930292873105648

So yeah this isn't a coincidence or just inspiration, they were made to copy Pokemon against their will by the CEO.

Nintendo doesn't have their charlizard brewing a big inferno this time around that's for sure but they do have a ma-chump to make them concussed and a jigglypooof to put them to sleep but they may summon a Uri Geller to finish them off with sleep talk.

@Arkay lol what Charlie is one of the best commenters on this hell site

Such a strange array of emotionally driven comments. The lawsuit has nothing to do with character design similarities. It's about patents, and if Palworld creators did infringe on them that's a cut and dry case. It will (or will not) be proven in court and case closed.

@Lofoten When were those Japanese patents filed?

And can you send the links here?

@NINTELDRITCH I'm glad they don't sue every single tiny person making a small gimmicky thing, and instead wait to stop the things doing actual damage to their brand, like this.
If this continues, people are likely to associate pokemon characters with this game instead of Nintendo and Pokemon company.
What's weird is if they are trying a patent instead of copyright or even trademark. That part doesn't make much sense.

@Mortenb because Palworld didn't copyright anything. There's literally other games that exist that have indeed copyrighted Pokemon yet no one seems to care about them, like Monster Crown. Monster Crown even has a tcg game they began making of it and they plan to do two versions of the games in the future and all.